Yes, it's not about the obedience here. Of course, you realize in the... is really part of the... the basic part of the conversation.

[01:01]

Conversion. Conversion, this being wonderful. Going upside down. Conversion, like Saint Peter. When you young were Peter, then you went where you wanted to go. But then there comes, when you get older, another will come and he will gird you. and lead you where you do not want to go. See, that's the, and there is a cross where Peter dies with this crucifixion with the head down and his feet down. Somehow that's also a part of the, of the incius, this turning, the head which is the bone that looks around and so on. turned down and then the feet kind of their hold in heaven.

[02:08]

Now, that was the in the code of arms of the heavens, ill forms, this word. So it is, you realize there is the total giving of all will, good or bad. It's very important. You enjoy that. Simply will. It doesn't say of what's bad, but of one's will, period. That's very important. And you can see that in the totality, I mean, how seriously that was taken.

[03:14]

You can see that from other things, because here in this giving up of one's own will, that means, of course, giving it into the hands of Christ. It is not the giving up of one's own will in a kind of suicidal manner, but it's giving it into the hands of Christ, surrendering to his representative. It's not the giving up of initiative or anything like that, you know, and cannot in that way give up oneself without killing oneself, but it is putting oneself under the obedience of Christ. And of course, again, as we said before, the voluntas of Christ is, of course, not a bad one.

[04:18]

So what is given up, you know, is really, let us say, all kind of ownership. Therefore, the vow of obedience is also the root of the poverty. That's why poverty isn't mentioned in these three vows which have become traditional in Benedictine monasticism. Poverty is not mentioned there, because to own something Yes, of course, nobody can own something as long as he has given up his own will that he cannot own. And again, you know, it shows you it isn't a bad will, because ownership in itself is of course not condemned, you know, by any kind of general Christian moral standards.

[05:23]

belongs to the basic rights of the person. If you, as a free person, earn something, then you also have the right to own something. But, of course, that is, in a monastic life, you know, that is eliminated by the power of poverty. And the power of poverty, of course, doesn't mean the acceptance in all the difference between the Benedictine concept and Franciscan concept, of course, but we don't speak about that now. But the essence of poverty is really the giving up of the self-will. That's the root of it. That's the meaning. Therefore, it's the giving up of this capacity or tendency of man to have things in his possession.

[06:43]

Or let us say, you can also say, under his control. Or you can also say, at his own disposal. At his own disposal. under his control. So, the obedience too is, of course, this giving up, you know, trying to keep things under one's own control, not owning something, possessing, ruling. That is the important thing. Therefore, the vow of obedience, of course, also includes the attitude one has towards oneself. For example, St. Benedict points that out in the chapter on the artisans in the monastery. There, somebody has a certain natural talent.

[07:46]

First of all, he doesn't own it, but it is left to the abbot's discretion if he can use it or not. And then if he is allowed to use it, still he has to continue that inner attitude of deep inner detachment. Because so easily, just by exercising a craft in which somebody excels, he wants to have control over it. And therefore, for example, also control the fruits of it. And then, of course, all this kind of natural pride, you know, that immediately comes up. As soon as I have done something, you know, then there's a kind of inner, you know, satisfaction.

[08:48]

This is my contribution. In some way, one delights in that, you know. Of course, natural. Wherever one meets it, wherever one becomes aware of it, there's this inner supernatural reaction to it. This inner delighting in one's own will. The serving, a law, a will which is not one's own, that brings the crown. So it's there. Very often, you know, you can, in St. Benedict Orson mentioned that in his rule, this kind of ownership, because also it's easily extended to the supernatural works.

[09:58]

I call your attention to that danger. The more one considers one's perfection as the result, the fruit of one's own efforts, the more one is in danger to consider this perfection as one's own achievement, and therefore also as one's own right. then we only sense any interference. One thinks, for example, oh my, I could be much more perfect if I had more chance, you know, for example, for fasting. Or, for example, if somebody, you know, is intent upon mortification and so on, and poverty, and then sets interiorly certain standards. How does poverty now that he wants, you know, how that should look?

[11:04]

And then there come the problems. Maybe it's always going to stand, usually the individual is then in the, you say, ahead of the others, whoever these others are, ahead of the others. And there comes then immediately also the question, why the way of comparing? Then one compares. Wherever one puts one's trust to speak consciously or unconsciously on one's own contribution, one compares. And the comparison is very often results, I mean, in doing an unfavorable judgment about the other. It seems to me, you know, if I compare myself to a brother so-and-so. First of all, one can only compare, again, if one considers oneself, one's own possession.

[12:12]

If one has the spirit of poverty, The spirit of poverty, that's it. Benefit is aiming, then one doesn't compare. You can think about yourself, you know, in your own spiritual life, this whole field of comparisons. That's a field in which all devils bounce. It's really true Kierkegaard has written there. Beautifully, just on that thing, comparison. Comparing destroys your peace. By the way, destroys your peace. To get into all kinds of terms. And usually it ends up with bitterness. What we call the bitter zeal. And the bitter zeal, of course, is that zeal that insists on one's own thing. So there's that whole field of poverty, you know, which is, of course, is rooted, which is part of this vow of obedience.

[13:21]

Therefore, you must also see right away that your inner tendency or your practical ideas about poverty must have to be put under obedience. I don't know if I'm clear in that, if you understand it, if I express myself, clearly not. As soon as, for example, in this whole thing of poverty, and the same is also the case, of course, for, for example, for standards of discipline, for, in all these things, observances, mortification, etc., etc., All these things, of course, serve the overcoming of one's own self-will. But the devil will, of course, immediately come in and say, God, your holy will, you know, that you want more than the other, you know, the poor average, you know, monk in this community is able to build, and so on.

[14:39]

There comes the thing. And everyone says, yes, that's true, of course, I'm much more radical in my, you know, attitudes, you know, and so on. And then that's God's will. And before you know it, you have your own little kingdom. And then you have your own standards and your own poverty. And that poverty is really your possession. That's then your little idol. Well, people, of course, there are many idols, you know, but we can, for example, poverty can be one of those things. It usually gets hooked on something external, you know, not so easily on something internal. But poverty is one of these things, you know. But poverty is simply, it isn't poverty anymore as soon as it causes you

[15:40]

To think, oh my, here, this isn't right, and this is too much, and that is too much, and this should be cut out, and that should be cut out, boom, boom, boom. Oh my, then you really own, you know, and to glory in your poverty. Then comes the other thing, for example, which is in the other vow. It's the vow of chastity, vow of gentile, celibacy. which is, of course, also in our, it is not expressed in our vows, it's not made any expressed vow, but it is included in the idea of obedience, the giving up of one's own will. Why was the Lord not married, you know? Non vimi facere volontate meram, set eius grimisit me. Because he was exclusively the instrument of that love which seeketh no trouble.

[16:47]

And that is, of course, lived in the form of agility. Because agility, for that matter, you know, average state, you know, is rooted really rooted in what shouldn't be any illusions about it, you know, it's rooted in the self-will. Necessarily leads to it, you know, it cannot be done. It's voluntas calmis, the will of the flesh, leads to marriage. Again, you know, of course, you have to say, you see, clearly that is not a voluntas mala. nothing bad. That's what I say. The obedience in a monastery is not something that prevents you from doing or wanting bad things.

[17:53]

The giving up of good things, which is so important. It's the essence even. It's the voluntas carnes, voluntas viri, you know, matter. Man has, in the natural order, yesterday we read that, we heard that in this very interesting book that we are reading at a table by, who is it? Gerard Bain. Gerard Bain. Of course, every man also has a woman in him, so to speak. very clearly, as soon as he enters into the realm, the orbit, of the agape. You cannot do that without, in that way, giving up. But Lyall is, of course, created as the crown and as the prince of this creation.

[18:56]

that it is man from whom the woman is taken. Therefore, man is naturally the head of the woman. And, of course, then when he marries, he is, of course, the woman is his glory, so to speak. They are all very good, you know. But, of course, it is not on this line known vain that our Lord says, and again I emphasize, our Lord Of course, he could not sin. So there is the, then, of course, he continues. Everyone who enters marriage continues, as it were, or works at the continuation and expansion of himself in his children.

[20:00]

So that, of course, is not possible either without the right of command. If somebody is a father, he has responsibility for his children. And that's, of course, his natural, in the very essence, you know, of his statement. And in that way, in this way in which the monastic spirituality sees it, you know, he cannot give up his own will. Of course, as a father, he has to do many things, you know, he has to take care of the... of the maintenance, of the upkeep, you know, the education and everything of his children. For that he has to work on things, and with things, or under conditions that he doesn't like at all. Of course, that is always the, in some ways, the which is connected with the voluptas.

[21:12]

Of course, the married man has not taken a vow, you know, to resign his own will. And if he takes a job that really isn't, you know, what he likes, he does it. Why? Because he loves his children. What does he love in his children? He loves his own flesh in his children, just as he loves his own flesh in his wife. So, in that way, the thing works on a different level. It is true, married life can be tremendous, you know, a tremendous sacrifice. Of course, it isn't by nature, it is essential character, intended to be a sacrifice. While, of course, the monastic life indeed is intended to be a sacrifice.

[22:14]

But again, you know, it's, of course, it's with chastity, it is the same as with poverty. Vigility can also be used by the devil. It can be used by the devil, for example, as, again, just as poverty. as a matter of pride, of personal achievement. As soon as the Virgin begins to compare, here I am, you know, with poor married people, you know, and so on, and all this kind of condescending attitude. Of course, again, absolutely wrong. It's against the inner nature of Virginia, because at that very moment one considers virginity as one's own achievement.

[23:18]

It doesn't say that everything that is good in me comes from God, I don't own it. Well, what is bad in me? That's the only thing that I own. You know, I have to get with it. That's the meaning of obedience. So, therefore, the celibacy, too, is rooted in this. The law of obedience. One doesn't have power over one's own body. And that is, again, you see, for that reason, too, in the monastic order, this power over one's body was always expressed in the necessity for the monk of value labor, that he accepts value labor under obedience.

[24:24]

That is the power which Christ exercises over his body. And that simply is not done in the same way in any kind of intellectual work or labor. You see, there is a whole theory, you can see that very often, you see, where, you see, the intellectual thing, the intellectual activity prevails or eliminates any form of manual oasis, the tremendous danger right away. There is a whole realm, the realm of the body, which... and the activity of the body, which is then withdrawn from the law of obedience.

[25:25]

Therefore, then, one has to have for the things, you know, the ordinary things, the maintenance things, the struggle with the daily lust, you know, one has to have other people, lay brothers or servants who take care of it. Of course, the great, you know, and that's the great danger of that situation. So, there is the virginity also as part of a being. And then, if you go one step further, then, of course, you also realize, you know that. this vow of obedience, you know, is the putting at the disposal of God, you know, surrendering, not only one's body, but also, of course, these, let's say, intellectual endowments, you know, all that, the education,

[26:41]

Then you, right away, you also see that there is the root for the lay character, you know, of monasticism. Monasticism is, and the wrong is, it is essentially a lay. There is that inner resistance, you know, which was there in monasticism, against the priesthood. Not because of any sectarian heretical thing. of not refusing, you see, to recognize the dignity of the priesthood, or of considering, for that matter, the monk, you know, superior to the priesthood. That may be here and there, you know, something like that may have played a role, but then on the whole monasticism, on the whole... In that way, monasticism always has recognized the objective sacramental dignity and power of the priesthood.

[27:57]

I wouldn't know of any example in a whole monastic movement where, for example, monks, after having attained a certain degree of sanctity, you know, would have declared Now we can celebrate mass, celebrate the Holy Sabbath. Never. I've never come across that in any monastic writings. Never. Because all I've felt there is a matter of the order which is given, the priestly character which is given. through the authority and the imposition of hands, you know, which is the expression of that authority, the part of the bishop. And that's, the monks have always, and if they refuse, the priesthood was, first of all, because they are initial through the, in the framework, you know, of their whole, what they are aiming at,

[29:08]

conversion, you know, this turning upside down, this resigning one's self will end. And even in good things, one is simply God's poor. And one has not, in that way, any kinds of claims or desires. And the priesthood of God is essentially a dignity and is a position of authority. It cannot be separated from authority. It's just, if you're a priest, you get, in the bishop, you get a ring. And that ring means that you are here, married to this parish and to this diocese, and that's your bride. But you are there the representative of Christ. You are the Adam, the new Adam, for your church.

[30:12]

And therefore, you also, you know, in that matter, have the authority over your church. And therefore, the authority and the exercise of authority is inherent in the very dignity of the priesthood. And therefore, The conflict, you know, which there arises with this idea of the giving of one's own will through obedience. But, of course, St. Benedict drew out the line, you know, he says, now if a monk, you know, is in obedience, you know, told, gets that, you know, then, to be a monk, to be a priest, then he shouldn't make any sense of it.

[31:15]

Then he should, in all humility, accept it. Of course, it would be good if he said, oh, dear Father Habert, I'm not worthy. Of course, that is what would be expected, you know, kind of, of the, from the monk. And so, In that way, you see, too, the idea is only logical, you know, because as soon as you, if it's set, you know, right at the beginning of your entire career that you are going to become a priest because you have that and that education and you know your Latin and everything, and you have... you know, gifts, you know, for studies. You see, then the entire life, you know, is taken, kind of taken off of the obedience.

[32:19]

And you, you kind of, not only expect to be absolutely sure, it's a matter of, it's understood that after you're in a way to start your studies. Your studies, in a way, the whole field, you know, that you do then, then after the studies, then you come, all the other things follow automatically. And so the, in that way, the, by the way, there's a whole field which is taken away and eliminated out of the, let's say, the range of the actual obedience. And then, of course, very much kind of bloods, you know, the whole age, so to speak, of that knife, you know, with which the Abraham, you know, is ready to kill his Isaac. So it turned out, you know, just puts, you know, really then right from the beginning, you know, kind of the choir on his own track.

[33:33]

Of course, it is true that the one who comes to the monastery in that way, very often he comes in an attitude that is, to riddle the amateur, I simply obey and I think of a priest. The attitude may not be that, you know, of claiming the priesthood for himself, and therefore we have also ignoring us, one must be just to see those things as they are, how many people enter into the monastery, and then are being told, of course, either with a priesthood then, now everything is connected to the priesthood, formality terror under the line of obedience. It's of course true, but therefore there are many holy choir monks who have grown up under these conditions, till now really and truly most there is absolutely, there's no doubt about it.

[34:50]

But the old tradition of good ethicism, also the rule of St. Benedict, did not accept that. And what I wanted to point out is only, you see, the reason why. Because St. Benedict, in this subtle way of the whole monastic life, he said, through the sloth of disobedience, we turned away. Now, what is the meaning of the conversion? That through obedience, we return. That's the whole theory. And into that, of course, the monk enters into that conversion. And into that conversion, he enters without any conditions, without any reservations whatsoever.

[35:52]

And with that also, as I've said, that surrender concerns everything. and therefore also the goodwill, and therefore also the vocation to the priesthood, that the individual may feel, may think he have. At the moment of entering the monastery, all that is put upon the altar. And that's very important also, of course, where every candidate, every a postulant and novice, you know, and especially in one's journey like this. It must be clear, you know, that also this one might feel a vocation to the priesthood. That is also belongs to these good things, you know, that nevertheless have to be put upon the altar.

[36:56]

Because otherwise, of course, Well, with the priesthood is given the authority, and with the priesthood also, and then say, is given with family, because the priest is a bridegroom, and he has a bride, and his bride is his community, and so on, and all these things. He has authority, and he has a field where he exercises authority. So in that way, if he would conceive of his vocation to the priesthood completely independently of his vocation to the monastic life, then there would be a conflict. That's the reason why I got seminary trappist monastery, too, in get seminary and so on. The trap is brought to keep the rule.

[37:57]

You see, that's the meaning. And therefore, everybody who makes solemn vows, you know, writes it down as quickly as I herewith, acknowledge and recognize and so on. That's why receiving, you see, the monastic consecration does not constitute any right on my part to become a priest. So that that is clearly Of course, you know very well that the entire idea of the priesthood in the church as a whole. Nobody can go and say, I am called the priesthood. I feel it and I know it. And therefore, you have to audit. It's, of course, not the case. Everybody. There are two things which belong to the priesthood. Two things belong to the priesthood. The one is the inner calling, and the other one is the official recognition of the, let us say, authenticity of the calling by the church.

[39:09]

Where that element is not, there is no vocation to the priesthood. So, and that, of course, is inner holistic life. If everyone who enters a seminary He cannot enter a seminary and say, I want to become a priest. Before he knows it, he may be told, you know, I get mad and I saw it, but that's the end of it, you see. So that is the same also in the, for example, in the monastery, also in a higher degree, you see, one can say in a deeper way. There too. has to put these things on the order. You cannot say, yes, of course, I mean, I'm going to become a monk, but of course, but God tells me I can be a priest. Nobody can tell me, you know, and that isn't so. It's not true. One cannot do that.

[40:11]

Because the nobody, as the epistle to the Hebrews, says, nobody has ever become a priest but his own will. But he is ex hominibus assuntus. He is picked out of man, not by himself, you know, but by God, through his instruments. And he is constituted then for man, you see, for man. That's also so very important. He is constituted for man as a priesthood. And of course, in monastic ideas, first of all, is that of obedience here, that through obedience we return to the one who we have lost through disobedience. That complete, and also, as it's said here, not renecatural academy, not come to do my own will.

[41:15]

but the will of the one who sends me. Of course, in that way, the representative of Christ in the monastery. In that way, that is part of it. So that is the lay character of monasticism, basically. Monasticism is, essentially, on the line of the Spirit, what we call the pneuma. The priesthood is essentially on the sacramental line. Not that the two put in the priesthood would be kind of separated, you know, but the main thing in the priesthood is the ordination. This ordination comes to him through the church and through the bishop. is given to him.

[42:16]

And that is where the priesthood stands on. Of course, monasticism, no. Monasticism, rather, is a matter of the spirit. Of course, you can see that right away. That is, of course, really a misconception, you know, to In that way, one can even say monasticism is much freer than the priesthood, much freer. It's much more a matter of personal initiative, of initiative which is, of course, based on the spirit, not on the imposition of hands on the part of the authority of the church, but comes from within. Why does the candidate come to the gates of the monastery?

[43:20]

He comes there in order to, absolutely impelled by the spirit, in order to serve that inner impulse that he realizes in himself. For example, in the priesthood, he was very often, you know, the case, and one of the reasons why the priesthood was compatible, considered compatible with marriage. Very often, I know that Abed Leo still told me, you know, that Bishop Hakim, you know, the dear Bishop Hakim over in Israel with the Arabs, you know, that kind of bishop, he would go to a village and they would see this village, the priesthood died, and He looks around, you know, now who is in this village the best Christian, you know? Then he picks him out and he says, here now, we have no priest, you should become a priest here.

[44:26]

Married or not, you should become a priest. Then he simply was told to become a priest. Do you see there, you see that on the other hand, the priesthood, you know, is, I hope sometimes we forget that in our Western world, everything is, you know, starts from within. In the, the priesthood is a charge, it's a charge. Onasticism for that matter is not a charge. And therefore, nobody can told, can be told to end a monastery. But he can be tall to become a preacher. So, for example, in Willem, you know, was the question of a bishop. And then the whole copula simply shouted on and said, we want Ambrose. And Ambrose was at the catish hue and wasn't even back then after. Will you? Thank you.

[45:32]

It's here that you know, the Universazione Morum Svorum. That's common, of course, the expression is taken from the chapter 58, the rule of St. Benedict. Universazione Morum Svorum. He says, in connection to that, is the seventh appearance of the word conversantio, and is the most important one. For those who hold, as does Eric Butler, that conversantio in rule has but one meaning and signifies vita monastica. You see, conversantio, of course, in that way, we also have that, you know, in... It's a translation, at least, in the Verga translation of the St.

[46:38]

Paul, Commersatio Nostrum in Schurices. It means there a translation of the Greek Polytheuma. Polytheuma, and that means really their citizenship. It means our whole society. Our citizenship is in heaven. There we have our, in German we'll say, there is our home country. Of course, the home country always means that one takes and walks according to the customs and the laws of one. Here, the conversatio monastica, or conversatio among monks, you know, in monastic circles.

[47:44]

The word conversatio simply means the fact that one is and belongs to the monastic order, to the ordo monasticus. One is there, then one observes and is taken into the auto monasticus. And in that way, it's two conversatio in, certainly, among the monastic literature, very often just means vita monastica and our belonging to it, our right as citizens. of the monastic community, of the ordo monasticus, belongs to that status of the monastic life, the monastic observance. But of course it is true, if you will then, if we, for example, become professional, the promise, conversazione moro meoro,

[48:58]

and of course the difficulty arises how would one translate it you know what does it mean there there's genitivus you know which evidently is the object of this you know the kind of the active way you know of handling or dealing with one's mores. And there, there the difficulty comes in conversationo moro meo. Here, this Paulus Hörgla, in this, then here, meet some conversationis. tries to analyze the genetic morays, you know, what are the morays?

[50:00]

The morays, then, he says, are simply the, again, you know, the kind of morays are the, again, an observance of way of life, by way of life. The morays, then, would here be Again, you know, the monastic way of life. But then, of course, you have a kind of expressing the same thing with two words. Condersatio would mean the monastic way of life, and the mores, again, you know, would mean the monastic way of life. So all that seems to me is very difficult, at least as far as the vow is concerned. What do I say when I say promitto? It seems to me that in this conversatio here has two meanings, you know, one can see that conversatio

[51:16]

one can say an intensification of conversio conversatio conversio in itself you know it is of course and always has the meaning of a let us say of one act of one moment we speak about the conversio sancti pauli the conversion of saint paul We speak sometimes in relation to ourselves. We speak sometimes when we say, you know, I had a conversion. Or when I had my conversion, that is then a moment in one's life in which, say, God, you know, took in a special way possession of us. In which we turn to him. in a new way, which means the beginning of a new life.

[52:20]

And the act of conversio is the beginning of a new conversatio, of a new way of life. And that conversatio, then, is in some way the status which is initiated by and which is brought about by the act of conversio. But of course if somebody at the moment in which he is received into the monastic life in which he then speaks about the conversatio or conversio modum, of course it is important here to notice what Justin McCann, you know, is that Paul the deacon, who is really Paulus Diaconus, you know, is really the first commentator of the rule of Saint Benedict.

[53:25]

In his profession formula, which is of course a profession formula, you know how things developed in Monte Cassino. Unfortunately, Monte Cassino was destroyed, you know, very soon after Saint Benedict's death. And of course, they are then, the monks had to leave Monte Cassino if there is a kind of a vacuum. There is a break in the tradition. And then, only about a hundred years later, the monks came back, you know, to Monte Cassino. And among them, there was then Paulus Diaconus, one of the, let us say, most conspicuous persons, in which Then the monastic life, you know, was re-established at Monte Cassino. And there we know the formula was Now that formula is the formula that we have, that has come down to us,

[54:41]

from Paulus Diakonus. That, of course, therefore has a great antiquity. And to my mind, it's one of the really authentic, the most authentic interpretations that we have. The conversion morum meorum secularium. And that seems to me that's very important here, because it really says we have, we don't have the word secularium, but we have the word conversio or conversatio morum maiorum. Now, what are these mores me? I can't see for the word of me that these mores, mores me, could be and mean in any way the mores which are established, the way of life is established in a monastic community. But they are the mores me. That means that kind of conversatio, that kind of life which I have and which I have, let us say, by nature, which is constituted by my character and all these things.

[55:53]

And there, of course, the mores made then are the, in some way, you can say, the old man. And the old man is the material for this conversatio. this. To my mind, it seems that the vow of the conversionem, and of course you know that you must always think that word conversion has been used in the entire monastic tradition, in the vows, from Paulus Diaconus down to, as Justin McCann rightly says, down to yesterday. Yesterday, of course, is the day when and Matthäus Woten-Häusler, and so on. Then Eamon Chapman, you know, Chapman came with the thesis, you know, that the original expression used here really is conversatio and not conversio.

[57:02]

Of course, it is true here that we have to... We have, in some way, we have, of course, here, in your difficulty, which, to my mind, is easy to explain. You know, what can you say? It is, of course, in some way, one doesn't promise, let us say, one act of conversion. Because this here is a kind of lifelong business. This promise here is the beginning of a new way of life. And in that way, of course, also, in that aspect, what is promised here is a, what we are saying, a continuous conversion. Or if you want to know what is promised here, it is a conversion which develops and which is lived as a

[58:08]

a conversatio. There is something that is a key constant. Let's say the constant, basic, you know, undertone, you know, of the entire monastic life. Something that is not only, what kind of was in that way, not proud of each, but there's your, there's a bon time act. But one, with what? this conversion, that's it, you know, that one engages upon, is that a right word? Engages upon a way of life in which one constantly works at the conversion of one's morals, you know. And that is, of course, the way of life which has been, one can say, which is innate.

[59:14]

But natural, what is dictated by character, it is dictated by background, you know, by all these things that we have received from this world. And in that way, of course, morum eorum secularium, seems to me is a legitimate, used by Paulus Deaconus, a legitimate interpretation of this moro meoro. That is, it says somewhere, the way of life of the old man, which is now supplanted by the way of life of the monastery, the monastic community. So that now the rule, the regula, and that regula which St. Benedict gives here, is from now on and constitutes the mores. That means the way of life of the new, of the monk, of the new man.

[60:22]

And in that way one can say that of course this wow conversion, Morum weorum is, as many people say, and I would guess that right, is simply the acceptance of the regular. The monastic rule has the basic basis, you know, for example, and the norm for the way of life of the new man. But, of course, you know very well that the rule of St. Benedict itself is, as he says, Initium Conversation. Initium Conversation. That means a beginning. It is therefore in some way the rule. It's a means, you know, for a constant conversion. For a life in the spirit.

[61:24]

of conversion. And that's what St. Benedict always emphasizes. This is for beginners. The rule is to reset, and it is the introduction, it is the catechetical instruction in the basic rudiments of the monastic life. It wants to be It is written for disciples. It is the law of a scholar. Of course, a scholar is, as you know very well in the antiquity, a scholar is a gathering, is an organization of people who profess and practice a craft, a scholar. It's what we later on in German, we call it, you know, it's not English.

[62:29]

Germany, I want to know, some guild, you know, guild, a guild. Always struck me for years, you know, kind of, to a role as an alumnus, you know, from, like back there from the north. And then there was one always passed by, going my train to Rome, and always passed by this scuola. It was an all broken down building, you know, really, and looked terribly, you know, and it was the scuola, the school, and for the drivers, of course, was a buggy. Carriage drivers, how would you call them these people who sit there, you know, and direct your horse and body? Carriage drivers. Carriage drivers.

[63:30]

Oh, carriage drivers. You see? The schooler of the carriage drivers. Now, what is the schooler of the carriage drivers? Of course, that place where they get together, where they disperse, you know, question of their... of their metier, of their craft, and where they instruct the young ones, the scholar of the cabbage guys, and so on. So the monastic, the monastery is a scholar. It means it is a place, you know, where the professionals, the conversational, the conversion, get together and learn the rules of the trade. The rules of the trade are put together in the regular. So, in that way, this profession is, you know, in that way, a profession of the rule.

[64:35]

But of course, I would say here, also, especially, you know, this profession has for its immediate objective and content, of course, those chapters of the world which really and truly constitute the basic elements of the conversatio, and that is chapter 4 to 7. That is great. That's the objective, the first and immediate object of this vow, chapter 4 to 7. Well, possibly, you know, because there is a great... And we know, of course, too, and that is important, you know, to remember that what we have today now, what appears to us as one book, of course, was not originally one book.

[65:40]

Originally, for example, we know that, for example, all the chapters, you know, from... from chapter 8, you know, down to chapter 19, you know, or 18. For example, where a book, a separate book, which really was there for the use and as a norm for the superior. Which chapters, what do they treat? These chapters 8. 8 to 18. Did you know what they are about in the holy rule, chapter 8 to 18? What is it? Hmm? 8 to 18. What is chapter 7? What is it on?

[66:40]

7th chapter. And then chapter 8. And then these chapters which are therefore regulation of the divine office. Of course, it is it is pretty much impossible to think that they would be the object in that way of the vow. Especially because, St. Benedict says, if somebody finds a better way of doing it, he may do it. See? He used to hear what I mean. They couldn't be the object of the solemn vow.

[67:44]

It's the last expression. But it's too... Because today, you know, that all these things overhand changed, you know, the 8 to 18, now, the thing that should be kept, first of all. But, you see, that is not true. And, of course, here, also later on in the rule, you see, it has been, for example, there is one codex, let us say, what we call penitenciades. That means those chapters which constitute, or what would you say, constitute the rules for punishment, you see? The penal code, you see.

[68:47]

Of course, again, that's kind of difficult to take a vow and then gain a code, you know. So those things, you know, are not, you know, and in that way, I would say, because if you say that this vow, you know, of conversion of moments, simply takes in, it is the vow on the whole of the rule, and then you think this rule is this here, what we have now, you see, and which evidently is a document which is as a compost, you know, later on, you know, in the course of the year. We have two endings there. We have one ending of the chapter on the portal. And then, after the chapter or the quarter, it starts on over again, with others who are additions, you know, you see, later additions.

[69:53]

And therefore, it is, to my mind, the bar of conversantium morum is, of course, it's a thesis, you know, I haven't seen it expressed in that way, in other publications, but usually, you know, today, more and more things, you know, he puts it that way, this vow of commercialization is the official and solemn acceptance of the rule as the form of life. See? And there, I would put behind that a question mark and say, well, now be careful what you need there, you see? And it seems to me that object of the vow, you know, is, of course, most of all, the process, you know, is, of course, first of all, chapter four to seven.

[70:57]

That is the very heart of it. But strangely enough, of course, those chapters are the ones, you know, which are in greatest danger of kind of not being considered. Because in any case, wherever you have an observance, what really sticks in the minds of people are, first of all, the various observances, you know what I mean? I think Gerald Bairn made a very good statement there in this book that we are reading, you know, where he mentioned there what was it, you know, the plural and the singular. I caught your attention to it, too, you know, that today, you know, things have turned to, have slipped from the singular to the plural, you know. One doesn't speak so much of grace as of graces, you know, graces.

[72:04]

And with that, power is graces. So also of observance and observances. The plural now, which is there, which means a collection of rules. a collection of observances. And that's, of course, in some way, is especially the practical mind, you know. Now, of course, every man or a human individual has a practical mind, and the practical mind sticks, you know, first of all, to certain observances in some way by nature. It becomes, as we say, things become more concrete that way. But here, Where this here is in connection with this vow, you know, I would very much, you know, see it really, also for you personally and as novices, you know, to see it, the meaning of this, in the light of these chapters, for to say.

[73:17]

Thank you, Mr. Paul, for the reason this, And that is really what one says. And of course, if you look at the contents of those chapters 4 to 7, then you realize that all these chapters really have, one can say, the undertone of conversion. A real constant conversion. What becomes, what really is the heart of our conversatio is conversion. I told you that so often. In your monastic life, what really constitutes, try to say, the progress, you know, is the inner constantly repeated conversion. That is, of course, as you see also, The basis on which, for example, the school is based.

[74:23]

It's a constant conversion. It means, notably, I begin all over again. At this moment, I begin all over again. This constant return. Through the labor of obedience, we may return. To the one whom we have lived. You see, that's our status, that are the more is made. We have lived by the sloth of disobedience. That are the more is made. Wonderful characterizations. Is it sloth? Sloth of disobedience. Next up, that they knew that the old was there.

[75:11]

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